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Ivan
Speed Merchant
731 Posts |
 Posted - 02 Nov 2008 : 16:08:55
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Looking for an email address or `phone number for Sandy , if anyone can help , can they send me a PM , please ?
It is Peace-Race related , the director of the Peace Race Museum near Magdeburg in the ex-GDR , hopes to invite Sandy , and possibly other Scots who have ridden the PR , to the Museum.
Leve de Wielersport |
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Ivan
Speed Merchant
731 Posts |
Posted - 02 Nov 2008 : 20:32:24
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Now got all the info I need , cheers.
Leve de Wielersport |
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mossy
Speed Limits N/A
1073 Posts |
Posted - 02 Nov 2008 : 22:59:30
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| Didn't Jimmy Rae ride the PR |
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David Jack
Crusing Past
207 Posts |
Posted - 03 Nov 2008 : 07:50:24
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I think Ken Laidlaw did
BJ |
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Ivan
Speed Merchant
731 Posts |
Posted - 03 Nov 2008 : 08:53:01
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Scots in Peace Race.
1952 Ian Steel and Ian Greenfield , first and only English-speaking winner in Ian Steel , first British podium for Ian Greenfield with a 3rd place on the crucial 8th stage from Leipzig to Karl Marx Stadt , where Ian Steel took the leader`s jersey. The BLRC team also took the team clas.
1957 Jimmy Rae , podium in 1st stage Prague - Brno
1959 Joe Christison
1960 Ken Laidlaw , second in KOM clas.
1961 Ken Laidlaw , fourth in KOM clas.
1962 Hugh McGuire
1963 First and only Scottish team in Peace Race , Drummond , Gardiner ,McGuire , Murphy , McNaught and Waugh.
1964 Jim Hendry
1966 Billy Bilsland
1967 Billy Bilsland , first Scottish stage win in Liberec in CZ.
1968 Andy McGhee
1972 Sandy Gilchrist
1973 Sandy Gilchrist and Denis Mitchell
1985 Ken Clark
1987 Martin Coll
1989 Martin Coll
Leve de Wielersport |
Edited by - Ivan on 04 Nov 2008 12:13:28 |
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Gordon Goldie
Speed Limits N/A
1162 Posts |
Posted - 03 Nov 2008 : 14:16:26
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| Ivan - what teams were Billy, Sandy & Martin riding for? |
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Ivan
Speed Merchant
731 Posts |
Posted - 03 Nov 2008 : 15:07:48
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quote:
[i]Originally posted by Gordon Goldie[/i]
[br]Ivan - what teams were Billy, Sandy & Martin riding for?
They were riding for the GB team , all the Scots who rode the Peace Race rode for the GB team , except the 1963 Scottish team , obviously.
The 1952 BLRC team was also a GB team.
ps When Billy Bilsland won his 1967 stage into Liberec, he was away on the hilly run-in with the Swiss Oschger , and one of the Peace Race greats , Gainan Saidushin of the Soviet team. At the finish , Saidushin , who finished second to Billy on the stage , remarked to the GDR coach that he expected to win the stage , but Billy`s strength
had amazed him.
Saidushin won everything it was possible to win in the Peace Race of the time , in 9 starts he won the final GC in 1962 , several stages , several team classifications and the KOM classification.
Leve de Wielersport |
Edited by - Ivan on 03 Nov 2008 15:32:38 |
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Tyler MacHamilton
Crusing Past
275 Posts |
Posted - 03 Nov 2008 : 22:07:52
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1968
Andy Mcghee rode the peace roace as part of the GB squad.
possibly with :- Geoff Wiles,Brian Jolly , Owen Davies ( Wales) Roy Cormack and Pete Smith
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Ivan
Speed Merchant
731 Posts |
Posted - 03 Nov 2008 : 23:36:46
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quote:
[i]Originally posted by Tyler MacHamilton[/i]
[br]1968
Andy Mcghee rode the peace roace as part of the GB squad.
possibly with :- Geoff Wiles,Brian Jolly , Owen Davies ( Wales) Roy Cormack and Pete Smith
You`re right , I`d overlooked him , apologies , the team was as above.
McGhee finished as well , like the vast majority of Scots who ever rode it.
Leve de Wielersport |
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usedbarum
Learner
23 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2008 : 10:27:13
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Ivan,
Can't remember the exact year(s) but the Ivys Kenny Clark def rode it once if not twice on a GB team
I'll give you one reason why you can do something rather than a thousand why you can't |
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Ivan
Speed Merchant
731 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2008 : 11:12:11
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quote:
[i]Originally posted by usedbarum[/i]
[br]Ivan,
Can't remember the exact year(s) but the Ivys Kenny Clark def rode it once if not twice on a GB team
I'll give you one reason why you can do something rather than a thousand why you can't
He did indeed , he rode in 1985 for GB , he`s down on the start-sheet as " Kenneth Clarke " , the 1985 Peace Race went to Moscow as part of the 40th Anniversary of the Victory over Facism.
It started with a prologue in Prague on 8 May , the race decamped to Moscow right after the prologue to do three stages in Moscow , then returned to Prague , before going to Warsaw and Berlin.
This Peace Race was a triumph for Lech Piasecki of Poland , he lead from start to finish.
Leve de Wielersport |
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joker
Speed Limits N/A
1133 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2008 : 13:00:27
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Is the peace race still run  , also was there a nuclear incident near where the peace race was ,i'm sure everyone was told to stay indoors but the race was the only thing that carried on |
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Lionking
Crusing Past
221 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2008 : 14:06:19
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That'll be why 'Kenneth' is still one of the main driving forces of the Anniesland Bunch every year!
Did his fellow Anniesland mucker 'Lesley' McCloud do the Peace race as well?! |
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Ivan
Speed Merchant
731 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2008 : 15:01:18
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quote:
[i]Originally posted by joker[/i]
[br]Is the peace race still run , also was there a nuclear incident near where the peace race was ,i'm sure everyone was told to stay indoors but the race was the only thing that carried on
The Peace Race wasn`t held this year , it remains to be seen if it will ever be run again. I`m really only interested in the race from its start in 1948 to around 1986 , after the collapse of Communism the race " collapsed " with it.
The 1986 Peace Race started in Kiev ( present day Ukraine ) on 6 May , the race spent 4 days in Kiev , a little more than a week after the Chernobyl Nuclear Reactor accident on 26 April 1986 , about 80 kilometres north of Kiev. The Western European teams , except France , did not travel to Kiev. The Soviet Bloc countries had to go in spite of huge reservations , Szurkowski , then Polish coach , didn`t want to go to Kiev but was ordered to take his team there. Olaf Ludwig , the 1986 winner , said in his book that if he had refused to go his career would have would have been over there and then. In spite of Chernobyl more than 1.000.000 spectators watched the 4 stages in and around Kiev.
Leve de Wielersport |
Edited by - Ivan on 04 Nov 2008 15:02:30 |
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Ivan
Speed Merchant
731 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2008 : 15:08:21
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quote:
[i]Originally posted by Lionking[/i]
[br]That'll be why 'Kenneth' is still one of the main driving forces of the Anniesland Bunch every year!
Did his fellow Anniesland mucker 'Lesley' McCloud do the Peace race as well?!
No , he didn`t , but there were several Scots who rode the Tour of Slovakia in the late 70s and early 80s , a rare example of a Scottish national team riding a high-level UCI race. This race was regarded as a " reward " for the invite to the Czech team at the Scottish Milk Race.
I`m afraid I don`t have much info on this race.
Leve de Wielersport |
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doc
Speed Merchant
683 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2008 : 15:20:01
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I gather that George Clare of Geoffrey Butler Cycles fame and Alan Bonsor both rode for Scotland in one of the Slovac Tours. George once told me that only he and Alan finished and he had to drag Alan out for breakfast/lunch/evening meal each day while the rest of the team stayed in bed and payed the consequences...............
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grambo
Crusing Past
332 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2008 : 16:38:50
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quote:
[i]Originally posted by Ivan[/i]
[br]quote:
[i]Originally posted by Lionking[/i]
[br]That'll be why 'Kenneth' is still one of the main driving forces of the Anniesland Bunch every year!
Did his fellow Anniesland mucker 'Lesley' McCloud do the Peace race as well?!
No , he didn`t , but there were several Scots who rode the Tour of Slovakia in the late 70s and early 80s , a rare example of a Scottish national team riding a high-level UCI race. This race was regarded as a " reward " for the invite to the Czech team at the Scottish Milk Race.
I`m afraid I don`t have much info on this race.
Leve de Wielersport
bobby melrose rode the tour of slovakia, and I think also wullie gibb and jamie mcgahan. Not sure who else rode - Sandy G would probs know. I remember bobby blaming a particularly hard stage of the slovak tour for the loss of all his hair....
" The man who sees the world at fifty the same way he did at twenty has wasted thirty years of his life"
www.dooleys-cycles.co.uk
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Edited by - grambo on 04 Nov 2008 16:39:56 |
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Ivan
Speed Merchant
731 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2008 : 16:52:10
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Other Scots who rode the Tour of Slovakia were Graeme Nisbet , Norman Lindsay and Alan Dudgeon.
Leve de Wielersport |
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joker
Speed Limits N/A
1133 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2008 : 17:10:03
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I think Alan Anderson rode it , not sure if George Kermode rode it  |
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WeePhil
Gaining Speed
105 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2008 : 17:11:02
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I think Alan Anderson and George Kermode from Dundee both rode the Tour of Slovakia, Ando still recalls the kicking he got racing with the big boys.
www.dundeethistle.co.uk |
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usedbarum
Learner
23 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2008 : 21:34:24
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Lionking,
Les Mcleod never rode the Peace Race but I know that he rode the Tour of Britain on an "International All Stars" team in the 70's - again sorry can't remember the year. This was the era of the old eastern bloc and the racing was pretty serious. He of course rode the old Tour of Scotland on a number of occasions - similarly E Bloc ruled OK!
I just wonder where these guys could get to in todays new world of (clean??) cycling
If I recall Ian Thomson managed the GB team in the PR on at least 2 occasions........ so when all these old guys give you a kicking............!!!!!!
Anyway - respect whee respect is due
I'll give you one reason why you can do something rather than a thousand why you can't |
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Ivan
Speed Merchant
731 Posts |
Posted - 04 Nov 2008 : 22:00:36
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Any Scot who could hang on to the Polish Scottish Milk Race teams of the mid 70s deserves a medal , the best Polish riders from that era and especially the ones who rode the SMR , which was a final test before the annual World Championships , were some of the greatest riders in the world , beter than 95% of the pro`s of the day.
Leve de Wielersport |
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Stev
Gaining Speed
179 Posts |
Posted - 05 Nov 2008 : 09:35:11
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| I remember Graeme Nisbet recalling riding in the tour of Slovakia and I think he had been unwell, but he kept riding, shot out the back on his own because he wouldn't let the supportive team manager call him a "chucker"... |
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mysterae
Speed Limits N/A
1053 Posts |
Posted - 05 Nov 2008 : 10:48:38
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As I could not race in Scotland but could race in England!!,I rode for Falcon Cycles for 61/62, later got a Job in Bermuda in '63 so bye again. Its good to see that we had a National team in the Peace Race and Tour of Slovakia, maybe the SC could apply and ask Mr Pat McQuaid for UCI membership we could have a National Team again
Thought I would bring this up on this thread:-
"When I started racing as junior there was more opportunities to ride for Scotland, this was an ambition you could aim for, with the IOM, Tour of Ireland, and Circuit of GB and other events all having a Scotland team, the Commie games every four years never entered my mind nor did the cinder or pro grass tracks which were on the go then.
As a junior I came up with a third place in the Sloan Trophy at Newcastle, by the way I cycle down there by myself, no funding then and enjoyed my season with basic training (habbals)? and clubruns over the previous years. good foundation work
In my second year as a senior I was selected to represent Scotland in the toughest amateur race here at that time the An Tostal Tour of Ireland 8 Day
It was a proud moment when I pulled on the Scotland jersey alone in my bedroom and admired myself, things were even better when I won the Tour,more honours to represent Scotland with a Stage win and wearing the leaders jersey in the Circuit of Britain.
My season was topped when I was selected to ride for Team GB in the Tour of Catalonia, (I must have impressed as I was picked for the Prague Berlin Warsaw the folling year and finished on the podium the first stage.
In 1959 I rode for Team GB in the Tour of Tunisia , Tour of Yugoslavia and the Tour of Polond. and finished well in all of them.
during the winter I was approched by Arther Campbell and asked if I wanted to be selected for the Tour de France in 1960 as it would be made up of National teams, but, I would need a professional licence. No problem! I took out a pro licence and armed with a selecion letter from the BCF went over to Belguim unsponsored to ride on a diet of Pro Kermesses, this I knew would end my racing ties with Scotland, as I would not allowed to revert to amateur, that was the rules then, so bye bye Scotland
The point I am making is that without a Scottish National team for seniors and a racing programe Scottish road racing will not progress, riders now have to come up through a sponsered club/team,
Martin and Alister are putting a lot into the sport and I wish them all the best, I have been organising events for the last 25 years and have seen many ups and downs,comings and goings."
Jimmy Rae
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Ivan
Speed Merchant
731 Posts |
Posted - 05 Nov 2008 : 11:24:36
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quote:
[i]Originally posted by Stev[/i]
[br]I remember Graeme Nisbet recalling riding in the tour of Slovakia and I think he had been unwell, but he kept riding, shot out the back on his own because he wouldn't let the supportive team manager call him a "chucker"...
The Tour of Slovakia was a 10 - Day race in mid September contested by national squads from all the Soviet - Bloc countries , it was a savage " mini Peace Race " , no Western European ever won it , it took riders of the level of Bernd Drogan and Hans Hartnick from the DDR , and Soviets at the level of Aavo Pikkuus to defeat the combined forces of the Czechoslovakian teams , usually 6 teams of 6 riders ie half the field. Unless you were at that level , few in the world were , it was a daily battle for survival , food was poor , accomodation often basic , prizes were cut glass , cutlery , cups and saucers etc etc Ali`s Cave stuff , all fairly typical for the time and place. It`s almost impossible to give a real impression of the competition in these races For all the Soviet Bloc teams it wasn`t about doing your best and then going back to work after the race , it was a brutal struggle to get in the national team , an achievement which could vastly improve your social standing , it meant status , money , a flat , a car , a coaching job at career end. These were all incentives enough , but they were coupled with a severe selection and training regime , a huge
meat-grinder which produced rider after rider vastly superior to the mostly-amateur selections from Western Europe.
The Polish coach Eddie B described Soviet Bloc coaches as " Killers " , they had only to find the best 6 riders from thousands , and they didn`t care how many riders they destroyed in the process.
This a long-winded way of saying that all these Scots who competed in these races , against these riders , with varying degrees of success , a few winners , the majority fighting to stay in the race , they all deserve our respect.
ps Theo De Rooij of the Netherlands won the T of S in 1979 ,a rare WE win.
Leve de Wielersport |
Edited by - Ivan on 07 Nov 2008 22:12:57 |
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Graham McG
Speed Limits N/A
1771 Posts |
Posted - 05 Nov 2008 : 12:24:53
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Wonder where these Eastern Bloc athletes ended up? Some dingy flat at the back of an industrial estate nursing Hep B with all the stuff that was shoved into them, forgotten by everyone (except Ivan ): or are they living it up in luxury dachas on the Crimean Coast still feted by their former paymasters? Suspect the former.
Ivan why are you so interested in the Peace Race, Slovakia and eastern Bloc riders? Not a dig, I'm genuinely interested.
PS. Remember a headline from Pro News in the '80s when a Soviet squad rode the Tour of Luxembourg and totally destoyed a field of pros including among others Sean Kelly - the headline was 'Russians Murder Pros' |
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Sandy Gilchrist
